Discworld marathon blog...

[Quatermass]

After the recent...debacle, I have decided to make a few changes to this marathon blog after I finish Moving Pictures. To make it a little more participant-friendly.

So, instead of reading them strictly in order, I will give the followers of this thread (assuming that there are any anymore) the choice of which Discworld book I will read next, under certain conditions:

*I must still read the books in publication order.

*The readers of this thread have a choice of the next book in a particular 'continuity', such as Rincewind, the Watch, the Witches, Death, etc.

*After the next book in a particular continuity is chosen, that continuity is off limits until I read another book in another continuity.

How does that sound?

In other words, the readers of this thread have the choice between multiple books:

Death: Reaper Man

Rincewind: Interesting Times

The Watch: Men at Arms

Stand-alone: Small Gods

The Witches: Witches Abroad

If you select, say, Small Gods, then I won't allow the next stand-alone book to be chosen (which, by my reckoning, is probably The Amazing Maurice or perhaps The Last Hero, as I count The Truth as pretty much a Watch novel) until I finish the book after it.

 

[DaveC]

I was fine with how you were doing it.

 

[The Mad Collector]

Same here, it is interesting to get another viewpoint on the books taken in sequence. Jumping around will break the flow and prevent any overview as to how the books have developed over time.

 

[Quatermass]

Same here, it is interesting to get another viewpoint on the books taken in sequence. Jumping around will break the flow and prevent any overview as to how the books have developed over time.

It will still be done more or less in sequence, just over the various internal continuities.

It was just a suggestion.

 

[Tonyblack]

One of the great things about reading them in sequence is that you see development in writing style as well as character development.

It's up to you, but as I always say - if it's not broke, don't fix it!

 

[Quatermass]

One of the great things about reading them in sequence is that you see development in writing style as well as character development.

It's up to you, but as I always say - if it's not broke, don't fix it!

Actually, the writing style varied. Guards! Guards! was brilliantly written, but both Eric and Moving Pictures were written less so.

It is broke because, in a way, there are plenty of Discworld novels that I've only read once that many fans consider to be the best, and it'll take me ages to get to them at this rate. Night Watch springs to mind. Plus, by offering alternatives, it helps give a sense of participation. And considering that I never take book suggestions with my book-reading blogs elsewhere, this is something of a novelty for me.

It's not up to me. It's up to the members here. If they want to go for it, then that's good.

While we're waiting, some music. I have this as my ringtone. Kind of perversely appropriate given recent events, that music.

 

[Quatermass]

REVIEW: Moving Pictures


After the triumph of Guards! Guards! and the nadir of Eric, coming onto Moving Pictures is something of a relief. While still a little old-fashioned in terms of writing, Moving Pictures begins a new trend in the series, where eldritch forces take the shape of some very familiar modern-day things...

The last Keeper of the Door in the isolated area of Holy Wood dies. Unfortunately, he has no successor, a dangerous thing when he is responsible for keeping back a disaster that wiped out an entire civilisation. And a new madness is starting to spread through Ankh-Morpork when the alchemists discover the concept of film. As the Discworld's burgeoning motion picture industry moves to Holy Wood, drawn by a strange magic, so does Victor Tugelbend, a former wizard student with a penchant for laziness. Unfortunately, he is one of the few people who can stand up to the magic of Holy Wood, and his companions are Theda 'Ginger' Withel, a country girl who wants to be famous, and Gaspode, a dog made intelligent by Holy Wood's magic. And they need all the help they can get, as CMOT Dibbler begins to exploit the movie business, the wizards of Unseen University begin to notice disturbances in the fabric of reality, and some Things are beginning to make their way into the world...

Moving Pictures has a number of firsts. As noted above, it is the first of the 'modern things' invasion stories that continue in Reaper Man, Men at Arms, and Soul Music. This time around, it is the cinema, with the storyline filled with rather average jokes and references to various films and movie studios. Where Moving Pictures gets its concepts best is when it comments on the magic of the movies, the 'madness' of those involved (those affected by the magic of Holy Wood are said to have literal stars in their eyes), and the cliches and tropes within movies, particularly in the Golden Age of Hollywood.

We see the characters of Ridcully, the (current) Bursar, Ponder Stibbons, and Windle Poons appear here for the first time, and while we see little of their character development that makes them into the characters we know and love today, they show most of the characteristics that would evolve in the process. We see the beginnings of the Bursar's later madness, with Ridcully's Brian Blessed-style of management obviously not conducive to a decent relationship. And we also see the beginnings of the modern Unseen University faculty, even if Windle Poons does not make it past the next book, Reaper Man...

Of the new characters, Victor and Ginger aren't quite interesting enough, being more like ciphers designed to get the story across. However, Gaspode, being a bastard mix of Greyfriars Bobby and the Dog from Footrot Flats, makes his first appearance, filled with sardonic observations on the goings-on in Holy Wood.

The story is full of wry observations on the nature of films and acting, but it seems to be little but. It's filled with promise that ultimately isn't fulfilled to the full, and the ending is filled with cliches. Of course, that was what it was meant to be about, cliches and tropes, but it sticks together in a rather tentative manner.

Ultimately, Moving Pictures is something of a disappointment, even more so when you realise that it introduces characters who will be in the Discworld series for years to come. It doesn't engage as much as it really should, a pity really.



Special New Utterance Rating Trial: Eh.

First words: Watch....

Last words: Holy Wood dreams.

BTW, is it me, or does this music(particularly after about 40 seconds, and please ignore the obvious reason why I chose it) sound extremely appropriate for the giant Ginger-thing clambering out of the screen?

 

[Tonyblack]

Moving Pictures is an odd one. When I first read it, it was one of my favourites, but now it's one of my least favourites. It (to me) is a collection of hidden movie references that almost read like a puzzle. But once you have solved the puzzle the story loses its attraction somewhat. The actual story underneath is a pretty weak one and I'm glad that when Terry does a similar thing with Soul Music, he makes the storyline a lot more interesting.

There are (as you point out) some favourite characters getting their first outing, but the main two characters of Victor and Ginger are kind of weak and, dare I say, that I'm more interested in what became of Teppic after Pyramids than what became of Victor and Ginger after Moving Pictures.

One subject that Terry lightly explores that I would have liked to see taken further, is the nature of Celebrity. It's something that is very relevant today with people who are famous for doing nothing in particular.

As to the music - it sounds like standard SciFi stuff. I've always seen that particular scene as largely being a parody of King Kong, with Kong being put on display in a theatre and then escaping causing chaos. It's also a parody of Attack of the 50Ft Woman.

Another interesting review, Q!

 

[Quatermass]

Thank you. And you brought up a lot of points that were bang on the money, Tony. Victor had potential, but really, he is Rincewind with laziness as a defining characteristic instead of cowardice. And Dibbler was frankly annoying in this, he works better as a less prominent character. Still, the concept of an Oscar as a sort of guardian golem is appealing.

I am currently reading my all-time favourite Discworld book, Reaper Man. Expect a review soon.

EDIT: About the music, I just thought it appropriate for the moment when Ginger-Thing crawls out of the screen. I'll pull up a clip later from YouTube that has that music backing it, because there are some marvellous scenes from a show that has things coming out of 'tombs' in a slow and sinister way, and for some reason, that connected with the Ginger-Thing sequence. Gimme a few minutes.

 

[Quatermass]

Here's the clip that I was talking about. I know, I know, it's from Doctor Who, but watch the Cybermen making their way out of their tombs. Now, I got the same sort of ponderous movement in mind when I was reading the sequence about the Ginger-Thing (or should we call it 'Giga-Ginger'?) breaking through the cinema screen. That's why the music came to mind.

And that, by the way, is one of my favourite cliffhangers from Doctor Who. "You belong to us. You shall be like us." That was the first Patrick Troughton story I ever watched, when it was found and released on video.

Anyone else have anything to say about Moving Pictures? I'll probably be finished with Reaper Man fairly quickly.

 

[The Mad Collector]

I agree with both of you on this one. Like Tony I enjoyed it when it came out but now when I go back to it I get frustrated by the way movie buff in-jokes take the place of a plot. With the appearance of new characters that stay the course in the ongoing series happening quite a bit in this book I always thought it a little odd that we never hear about Soll Dibbler again not even in Soul Music where Dibbler again rises to be a major character in a book.

The books saving grace for me is that it was the setting of the Discworld II computer game, a highly enjoyable romp through the Discworld which follows the plot of the book quite closely in places.

 

[Jan Van Quirm]

I have a nostalgic fondness for Moving Pictures and I still rate it reasonably high, mostly because of Gaspode as he's definitely the strongest character in there. However, the Dibblers run him a close second and I think it's their involvement and the whole Blown Away sub-plot that makes the finale so good because it's such a Hollywood cliche in the Roundworld sense - I can't believe you don't see that as inspired and more than a one-laugh theme. It still makes me smile when I re-read the book. Not laugh out loud, which is where the nostalgia's kicking in as the jokes become a comfy slipper.

The product placement aspect at the premiere is wonderful with the not so subtle subliminals in the mix too and the general hype attached to it is wholly redolent of the whole Gone With the Wind legend and the Dibblers cast as the Goldwyns and the Selznick parodies - it's bloody clever as well as hilarious and the Dibbler as impressario is established for Soul Music but unlike you I think it's the MP version that's the strongest and most successful because it's the sustaining comedic structure for the finale

 

[Quatermass]

I have a nostalgic fondness for Moving Pictures and I still rate it reasonably high, mostly because of Gaspode as he's definitely the strongest character in there. However, the Dibblers run him a close second and I think it's their involvement and the whole Blown Away sub-plot that makes the finale so good because it's such a Hollywood cliche in the Roundworld sense - I can't believe you don't see that as inspired and more than a one-laugh theme. It still makes me smile when I re-read the book. Not laugh out loud, which is where the nostalgia's kicking in as the jokes become a comfy slipper.

The product placement aspect at the premiere is wonderful with the not so subtle subliminals in the mix too and the general hype attached to it is wholly redolent of the whole Gone With the Wind legend and the Dibblers cast as the Goldwyns and the Selznick parodies - it's bloody clever as well as hilarious and the Dibbler as impressario is established for Soul Music but unlike you I think it's the MP version that's the strongest and most successful because it's the sustaining comedic structure for the finale

To each their own. I don't know enough of Gone With the Wind's story or production to get most of the relevant jokes, and the whole advertising thing, to me at least, gets old. Soll Dibbler does act like a decent foil to his uncle, though.

Anyway, these are just my opinions. And as for Soul Music, well, we won't know until I re-read it properly.

 

[Who's Wee Dug]

Moving Pictures is in my top ten favorites I just like it for the Hollywood parodies.

 

[Quatermass]

Hey, how many variables do the polls on this BBS go up to? Anyone know? There are, what, 38 books? In my experience, there is only room for 20 options in a forum poll. A pity, we could have had a couple of polls on the best and worst Discworld books. But then again, there'd be arguing about the results and then flaming and wailing and gnashing of teeth...

 

[flammableben]

Hey, how many variables do the polls on this BBS go up to? Anyone know? There are, what, 38 books? In my experience, there is only room for 20 options in a forum poll. A pity, we could have had a couple of polls on the best and worst Discworld books. But then again, there'd be arguing about the results and then flaming and wailing and gnashing of teeth...

Just signed up, but I read through all your reviews over the last couple of days and thoroughly enjoyed them. Can't really comment on Moving Pictures, it's been a few years and last time I read it and I just remember it being a bit of a mess.

On the subject of polls though, I know I'm new, but I'm generally of the opinion that they don't really tell you that much. Someone writing out why they disagree with me and think that Pyramids is one of the best Discworld books (even if it's not aimed at me), is worth 1000 people clicking a button to agree with me that they don't like it. It's the "Why" people enjoy/dislike which is interesting, not the "What".

Someone clicking a poll option is never going to make me think.

 

[Tonyblack]

Apart from anything else, my opinion of these books tends to change over subsequent re-readings. As I pointed out, I once thought Moving Pictures to be one of the best books - I don't now. And I never cared at all for Monstrous Regiment, but now it's one of my favourites. So a poll might give a snapshot of how people feel about the books now, but that doesn't mean it will stay like that. And a lot of the people who would contribute will not have read all the books, so the ones they haven't read might won't get a look in.

I don't trust polls - I never have. For a start you'll always have people who won't do polls and people who will go out of their way to do them. Ages ago I did a poll on this site to try and prove a point. I asked how many members wore glasses. If those figures were taken as being a reflection of the population of the world, then it suggests that most people wear glasses - and that is clearly not the case.

 

[Quatermass]

Leaving aside Moving Pictures and the question of polls...

Ah, bugger, I forgot what I was going to say.

Hmm...

Actually, while I am reading Reaper Man, let's get onto the subject of autographs. My copy of Reaper Man is autographed by Terry, with the slogan 'Read it and Reap', along with a doodled scythe. I'm curious, does Terry use the same slogan for the copies of the books that he signs?

 

[Dotsie]

Maybe on that particular day. I'll bet he mixes it up a bit.

Now he just uses a thumbprint (except for special occasions).

 

[deldaisy]

Rereading Moving Pictures as we speak.

Terry Pratchett and that other book I always rave about are the only books I have ever read twice over. (so many books..so little time)

It was rereading Last Continent that inspired me to reread alot of the DW books. I got Moving Pictures out of the library this week and as I walked along the rows and rows of books I was kicking myself at getting out two books I had read ALREADY.... blasphemy! But having said that.... the reasons are these.... I never liked Last Continent much (and by that I mean as a DW book... because its rarely I like ANY book as much as a Terry Pratchett book).... and I only reread it again to see if the Australia-isms HAD gone over my head (because of familiarity... and yes they had)... and I was so suprised that I enjoyed it more this time .... had a whole new respect for it.

So I will go back and reread Pyramids... because that has always been my least favourite book.

I agree completely about polls... and some people vote off course just to stuff up the results.

Interesting fact... I REALLY love the witches books... and can't wait to reread Witches Abroad and Equal Rites....and of course love Lords and Ladies.... when I asked for their copies they said.... "Oh those DW books are always on a waiting list.... always!" So I am on the waiting list too... but.. it IS telling isn't it.

I am loving Moving Pictures all over again. Yes the movie references are great fun to hunt down... but as with all first readings of a DW book you GET the jokes but its a wonderful rush to read it (turn the page, turn the page)... nice to read it slowly this time and look for more of the jokes or as jan said... find old friends.