Danny B said:
(Can) Moist have any moral authority in the story, due to his despicable and reprehensible actions in the past?
Moral authority /ethical authority does it matter? Moist has
no credibility.
Readers know this. Vetinari, Drumknott and Mr Trooper know this because they were "in" on Spangler's hanging.
Morals are what a society collectively decides a certain standard is.
usually behavior, often belief. Either way, morals are man-made = made-up.
Ethical authority is kind of neat. I'll come back to that.
Danny B said:
Initially, Moist treats his "appointment" as another con; trying to get people to believe he's a good and trustworthy person.
That is Moist's stock-in-trade. Getting people to believe -in him, in his trustworthiness, in his "line"-- is what he's always been about.
Danny B said:
Over the course of the novel, I think this gives way to something much more, Moist trying an even bigger con. Trying to convince himself he's a good and trustworthy person.
Does he? Or, every few pages, does he think: "I can give this up anytime. Next week, maybe. After I see Spike again."
Moist is under no delusions as to what he is.
Moist used the money he stole to rebuild the PO (and for a few tithes --which he called "stealing"), but
only because Gilt upped the ante when he had Gryle burn down the PO.
Moist wanted to
WIN. He felt no sense of duty or civic pride or shame or regret or repayment.
When the PO burned, it became a pi$$ing contest between Moist and Gilt.
Maybe Moist wanted revenge for Anghammarad's death. Maybe he wanted to beat a con man better than he. Maybe he wanted to impress Spike. Maybe he was afraid that Vetinari's "offer" would be rescinded since there was no Post Office left.
Moist lives for the thrill. For excitement. For the idea that he
might get caught out and lose.
Lots of us do, too. We go rapelling. Ride motorcycles. Play poker.
Danny B said:
Moist is punished for his crimes, although not in a conventional manner. Vetinari makes him famous, removing his anonymity ... his primary weapon of deceit and neutering his ability to perpetuate further thefts.
Not until Making Money when Moist reveals himself to be a conman who "survived" a hanging.
Although Sacharissa's articles and Otto's pictures probably didn't help.
Danny B said:
Vetinari puts him to work in a job that killed people better trained to deal with (physical) danger. I don't think Vetinari expects Moist to succeed or even survive.
Like a chain gang, but Mr Pump is the chain.
Moist's life as Spangler et al is already forfeit, why shouldn't Vetinari use him to challenge Gilt?
Gilt is running the Grand Trunk. But, he's also on the boards of other A-M companies.
Vetinari
knows[/] he will have to eliminate Gilt and his influence.
Vetinari also knows he can't simply challenge him --legally or any other way.
So, Vetinari uses Moist, who's already "dead," to stop Gilt for the sake of the city.
Danny B said:
Moral complexity is something Terry excels at, often putting stereotypically "good" acts into the hands of bad people ... Fairy G-Mother, Vimes, Granny Weatherwax
Yes, he is.
Everyone truly loves something. Might be an ideal or an abiding passion.
Might be a person, but usually not. We manage to learn to get along without people we love.
That "love" is, generally, the line that most folks won't cross.
Vimes loves A-M. Granny loves the Ramtops. I forget what the Fairy G loves, I havent' read WA in a while.
Moist cherishes his freedom. That's why he's so angry about Mr Pump. He cherishes his "medium" face /build /looks because they allow him the freedom he loves. That's why he doesnt' want his face known --the suit & hat, ok, because they are nothing more than another persona.
Does Moist really change in this novel? No and maybe.
Only so much as he stops lying to everyone else and lies to himself that he "can give it up any time."
We're left with the Man versus Himself basis of conflict at the end, just as we had it in the beginning.
Did resolve Man V Banshee, Man V Big Corps, Man V Boris, Man V Legal System.
In the end, Moist still has to face who he is and he still doesn't want anyone to know.
He's making it up to make Moist a more sympathetic character. We know very little about Moist's early life other than he was brought up by his grandfather who bred dogs.
