How the Discworld books were written

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lwhitehead

Guest
#1
Hi I still trying figure out Terry Pratchett's writing style for Discworld novels, I mean if any one else did what he did in each page would that be ripping off?.


LW
 

Tonyblack

Super Moderator
City Watch
Jul 25, 2008
31,011
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Cardiff, Wales
#2
Terry's writing style evolves throughout the Discworld series. He goes from parody to satire, while still retaining a good deal of parody. But mostly he writes about the way humans act and react. He fits those reactions to his characters and puts them into a world of his own design.
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#3
Well what I'm worried about is ripping some ideas off, like in my world with Six Seas and take place in Golden Age of Piracy in the 21th Century it also has a Caribbean were Port Lucre is located on an Island based on Cuba.

LW
 

=Tamar

Lieutenant
May 20, 2012
13,274
2,900
#4
Exact copying of sentences is ripping off. Expansion of ideas into a different direction is not ripping off; it's being influenced, stimulated by, maybe paying homage to, there are lots of subtle distinctions. There are books listing the One or 24 (or 36, or 72) Basic Plots, patterns onto which virtually all stories can be mapped, but the differences are what make it original. Yours sounds different enough to me.

What most of the bad imitators do is grab a single element, usually the idea of funny footnotes, and scatter it through their book. There's nothing technically wrong with a funny footnote. Nabokov's Pale Fire has an entire story in the footnotes, which greatly outnumber the official story-poem-elegy (which is itself marvelous and people should read it), and their existence is directly related to the plot. Nabokov's style and content are completely different from how pTerry worked it.
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#5
Um well Monkey Island series which is the other main insperation for my series is now owned by Disney and they take a dim view on protential rip offs of there products.

For example I like Stan S Stanman for the Monkey Island series he is very much like C.M.T. Dibbler but he wears loud clothes, Dibbler is based on a Spiv while Stan is more a Used Car Salesman,

The Funny Footnote how can I use properly in my Writing per page?,

The setting will have Magic and Fantasy creatures suitable for the Ocean and relating folklore, such as Voodou

LW
 

RathDarkblade

Moderator
City Watch
Mar 24, 2015
17,663
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#6
lwhitehead said:
Um well Monkey Island series which is the other main insperation for my series is now owned by Disney and they take a dim view on protential rip offs of there products.

For example I like Stan S Stanman for the Monkey Island series he is very much like C.M.T. Dibbler but he wears loud clothes, Dibbler is based on a Spiv while Stan is more a Used Car Salesman,

The Funny Footnote how can I use properly in my Writing per page?,

The setting will have Magic and Fantasy creatures suitable for the Ocean and relating folklore, such as Voodou

LW
All right... *cracks his knuckles* I'm afraid this is going to be long, LW, but I'm giving you the best advice of my experience. I've been writing since I finished high school (which was a long time ago now), and have published a few things.

So, I'll deal with your questions one by one - here's my advice:

1. For example I like Stan S Stanman for the Monkey Island series he is very much like C.M.T. Dibbler but he wears loud clothes, Dibbler is based on a Spiv while Stan is more a Used Car Salesman,

Firstly, never ever copy a character or a situation wholesale. I know the Monkey Island world very well, and yes, Stan is a very funny character. But don't simply copy him; he is copyright. If you copy him, you will be held guilty of copyright infringement; the penalty for that, last I checked was 5+ years in jail and/or 100,000 Pounds per infraction. It's not worth it.

Having said that, how can you make a character like that your own? Stan, like many salesmen, speaks very fast; but his loud jacket and sombrero make him unique, they make him stand out. So ditch those, and think of other ways that your character could stand out. Clothes are the most obvious example, but what about other things? A lazy eye? A moustache? Glasses? A nervous tic when he speaks? An unusual scar? Pick maybe two or three, no more - otherwise it sounds like you're overloading him with features to make him 'cool'.

Having picked two or three, think of how he got them. Suppose he has a scar - how did he get it? A shaving accident? A duel, perhaps? And suddenly, your character has a back-story that makes him more interesting, more human.

The more you do this, the more you'll find your own voice, and you won't even need to look at other people's characters. :) It's fine to use a character template - the fast-talking salesman, the honest cop - but make yours different from other people's.

2. The Funny Footnote how can I use properly in my Writing per page?,

The short answer is: use footnotes sparingly. If it's possible to get away with not using them at all, do it. The WORST thing you can do is use a footnote to expand on the story or on a character's name; suppose that you create a clever name, and you're DYING to tell people what the name means by putting it in a footnote. It's best not to. It just makes you look like a braggart.

As a very rough guide, one footnote per 6-7 pages is sufficient.

3. The setting will have Magic and Fantasy creatures suitable for the Ocean and relating folklore, such as Voodou

Hmmm. I think you may have the wrong end of the stick - I looked up "Voodou" on google, and got a hair salon. Do you mean 'Voodoo'?

Even so, I don't see what voodoo (or voodou, whatever that is) have to do with the ocean or fantasy creatures relating to the ocean.

If you're looking to involve ocean-based mythological creatures, or something based on voodoo, my best advice is... pick up a book relating to mythology or to voodoo. If you're looking for information about Greek mythology, I would recommend this book by Philip Matyszak, one of my favourite authors on all things to do with ancient Greece and ancient Rome. Maty, who has a Doctor of Roman History (Oxford) and who teaches ancient history at Cambridge, also writes books for the general reader. He writes very clearly, so even the most non-specialised reader can understand; his writing is witty, well-researched and readable by anyone. Highly recommended. :) If you don't want to buy it, I'm sure your local library will have some of Maty's books.

As for voodoo - this area isn't my specialty, but again, your local library will be the best place to start. I can only offer the following advice: there's a lot of nonsense written about voodoo. It's not always easy to differentiate truth from hysteria or misinformation. When you pick up a new book about it, look at who the author is and ask yourself: does this author look credible? Did he/she study voodoo in any meaningful way? The best information about voodoo comes from people who have been to Haiti, the birthplace of voodoo. Alternatively, New Orleans has a big voodoo culture, but it is difficult even in New Orleans to differentiate fact from fiction.

All this talk of voodoo and fantastical sea-creatures reminds me of the plot of Monkey Island 5: Tales of Monkey Island by Telltale Games, a game that was released 7 years ago. If you're going to go that route, I'm begging you - don't. Stop and think about what you're doing, particularly if you have characters named Guybrush or Elaine, or Murray the Demon Skull.

If you are writing fan-fiction, that's different. Some companies are more lenient about fan-fiction than others, and might look the other way, as long as you're not making money off your fanfic. Disney, as you pointed out, are very protective of their copyright - although I'd wager that Disney don't give a rat's patootie about Monkey Island, but that's another story.

If you're going to write something based on Monkey Island, the best thing to do is to create your own world. You mention that your world has "Six Seas and take place in Golden Age of Piracy in the 21th Century; it also has a Caribbean, where Port Lucre is located on an Island based on Cuba." This sounds suspiciously close to the Seven Seas of the real Golden Age of Piracy (1650s-1730s). Earth also has a Caribbean sea - and while it didn't have a Port Lucre, I presume you're getting the name from Lucre Island (from Monkey Island 2).

In the end, what it comes down to is this: if you're going to write something, do your homework. Read widely about the subject, so you can get as wide a range of education in it as possible. Don't restrict yourself to a single source. I'm currently writing a novel set in ancient Rome, and I have at least 10 different books about different aspects of that fascinating city.

There are always new things to discover. Don't limit yourself! The sky is the limit and so is your imagination. All you have to do is put in the hard yards and let your imagination fly. Good luck! :)
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#7
Lucre is from Filthy Lucre, But I can call something else, If I can't have a Caribbean then what I'm I going to call the area inspired by the Spanish Main.

For example Davy Jones is seaman's version of the Devil, but he would more like be the Reaper my version and I hope Disney doesn't sue is that he gather the dead aboard his Coffin ship, he isn't a squid man but a skeleton dressed as a Captain. He sails to the Dead Sea to Skull Island were the River Styx flows into the Dead Sea, so he is my version of Charon.

As for Voodoo it's mention in On Stranger Tides, Skull & Bones RPG and in the Monkey Island series,also the Magick in this series in Country based as well since we have Africian like tribes that were inslaved they would have Shamans as well.

As for Ocean based Fantasy creatures we have Mermaid, Pixies, Selkies, Sirens, and Sea Monsters.

As using Cuba Islands I point to A Song of Ice and Fire they took a well known landmass and flipped upside down, I'm turn Cuba Clockwise until it stand up and down.

LW
 

=Tamar

Lieutenant
May 20, 2012
13,274
2,900
#8
lwhitehead said:
Lucre is from Filthy Lucre, But I can call something else, If I can't have a Caribbean then what I'm I going to call the area inspired by the Spanish Main.
Lucre is fine as it is; "filthy lucre" is a standard phrase, even a cliche, in English and not copyrightable. If the island is genuinely filthy, that's an additional pun. You can definitely have a Caribbean, that's the real name of the area in English. Nobody can claim they own the word by itself. However, if you are changing the geography (Cuba in a different position), then you might want to come up with a reason for it to have the same name - is this a post-apocalyptic universe (after a disaster destroys our known civilizations), or is it an alternate universe (where things happened differently from quite a long time ago)? The Caribbean was named after the Caribs who lived there before the Europeans arrived.

lwhitehead said:
For example Davy Jones is seaman's version of the Devil, but he would more like be the Reaper my version and I hope Disney doesn't sue is that he gather the dead aboard his Coffin ship, he isn't a squid man but a skeleton dressed as a Captain. He sails to the Dead Sea to Skull Island where the River Styx flows into the Dead Sea, so he is my version of Charon.
I think that should be clear of any problems. Charon and the concept of the boatman are ancient ideas. Davy Jones is a well-known legend. Skeletal Death is a standard form, and skeletons in general show up a lot in myths. If he has a crew who are also skeletons, the obvious pun on "skeleton crew" is widespread. Ghost ships and the story of the Flying Dutchman are also free to use. Use Google or another search program to find examples.

lwhitehead said:
As for Voodoo it's mention in On Stranger Tides, Skull & Bones RPG and in the Monkey Island series, also the Magick in this series in Country based as well since we have Africian like tribes that were inslaved they would have Shamans as well.
Voodoo/Voudoo/Voudon/Santeria has many spellings and many variations. It is an active religion, with variant forms of use in different places. You might choose to avoid actually using those words for the version you are creating for your story. Instead, just describe the specific uses that happen, call it by the kind of not-quite-name that people use when they talk about something they are afraid of, or even things they practice but keep hidden. For example in the UK people often wouldn't say the word "elf" or "faerie", hoping to avoid calling attention to themselves; instead, they'd refer to the Fair Folk, the Little People, the Kindly Ones (or is that the Greek byname for the Furies? it's the same idea anyway), and so on.

lwhitehead said:
As for Ocean based Fantasy creatures we have Mermaid, Pixies, Selkies, Sirens, and Sea Monsters.
All of those are known names, though I'm a little surprised to see pixies called sea creatures. Do you mean nixies? You could have quite a lot of fun with how they may interact - how many kinds of sea monster? do they have a government? do they inhabit different ecological niches, or do they compete for resources? etc.

lwhitehead said:
As using Cuba Islands I point to A Song of Ice and Fire they took a well known landmass and flipped upside down, I'm turn Cuba Clockwise until it stand up and down.
That is a common practice for fantasy novels; in Diana Wynne Jones's book about the cliches of fantasy, the sample map was the map of Europe turned sideways. Her book is The Tough Guide to Fantasyland and I recommend that you read it.
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#9
The Island itself is based on the shape of Cuba but not called Cuba but Guinea after the tribe of people founded there, also known for making use of Gold

I mean a Winged Fairy in a Binnacle Lamp, a GPS.

Now this world of Six Seas, Seventh is the sky full of Stars the Culture is 1660 to 1690's in the 21th Century

LW
 

=Tamar

Lieutenant
May 20, 2012
13,274
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#10
lwhitehead said:
I mean a Winged Fairy in a Binnacle Lamp, a GPS.
Oh, now I think I understand. The pixie is being used at sea, not living in the ocean.
The story sounds like it will be entertaining.
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#11
Well that's inspired by Tinkerbell yes I might be afraid using it though Disney might sue since they sell Tinkerbells in Binnacle Lamps,

A little Patrick O'Brian is this Satire setting as well his Naval fiction in full details, my Footnotes which you people say has to limited them to 5 to 7 pages each I could also explain some details such as a Noggin and a Gill which is 5 Imperial ft Oz in US 4 Ft Oz ( leave to the Americans to knock of an Oz)

I have to create Satires of the Nations that were active during the Golden Age of Piracy,


LW
 

=Tamar

Lieutenant
May 20, 2012
13,274
2,900
#12
lwhitehead said:
Well that's inspired by Tinkerbell yes I might be afraid using it though Disney might sue since they sell Tinkerbells in Binnacle Lamps,
Don't mention Tinkerbell and you might be clear. The basic idea of a firefly in a jar can be the inspiration, and kids have caught fireflies in jars for generations. Glow-worms aren't pretty and they don't fly. If it has to both fly and be cute, that could be a glamour put on it by the seller, or a protective coloration-shape evolved from being caught; maybe the ugly ones were killed, while the pretty ones were let go to reproduce.
lwhitehead said:
I could also explain some details such as a Noggin and a Gill which is 5 Imperial ft Oz in US 4 Ft Oz ( leave to the Americans to knock of an Oz)
Actually, in that case it wasn't that the Americans changed anything. Americans still use the old UK measurements. It was the UK that invented their own new measurements when they were celebrating being an empire, to brag that everything they did was bigger. (The UK Imperial fl Oz was made smaller so that their larger now-12-Oz cup would be only slightly larger than the old 8-Oz cup. It makes translating 19th century recipes very tricky, while 18th century recipes are easier.) That wasn't unusual either, except for making something bigger instead of smaller; every country had its own measurement system, which made commerce complicated. You had to check what the money exchange rate was, and you also had to investigate what weights and measures were, in every port and city. The naive businessman would lose money if he blithely trusted the merchants. That's why there is a carefully guarded international standard meter kept in a temperature-controlled vault, because even now people would cheat if they could. Even now, just look up the differences of silver content in what is called "sterling silver" in different countries. Some "sterling" rings have so much copper that it will turn your finger green.
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#13
Male and Female Pixies are caught to be used in Binnacle Lamps as GPS, (short for General Pixie Service it's a job of the Pixie to sit the Lmap next to the Pilot and shot at that person why direction they are going or were they are).

Now as stated before this is a 17th Century culture and timeframe in the 21th Century, like Discworld is can I get in trouble for that?.

LW
 

RathDarkblade

Moderator
City Watch
Mar 24, 2015
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#14
Instead of Tinkerbell, you could give your fairy a name that sounds similar but isn't. For instance, how about synonyms of the words 'tinker' and 'bell'? "Dabblebuzz", or "Doodlechime" - or anything like that. ;) Just a suggestion... I think it should be okay, legally, but I could be wrong. Does anyone know? If so, please feel free to correct me. :)
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#15
Tinkerbell in the Binnacle Lamp was the idea for the GPS idea, and Fantasy version of our world's GPS.

Now as stated before I need help with the fact that I've got to create Satires of 17th Century Nations,

LW
 

raisindot

Sergeant-at-Arms
Oct 1, 2009
5,337
2,450
Boston, MA USA
#16
Tony could you move this topic somewhere else? This has absolutely nothing to do with discussion of Discworld novels. Maybe we need a special "Give me free advice on how to write my book" topic area somewhere.
 

raisindot

Sergeant-at-Arms
Oct 1, 2009
5,337
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Boston, MA USA
#18
Yes, the "new member" tag had me confused for a minute, then a quick search pulled up dozens of topics about this same "novel-planned-by-committee-that-can't-be-named-or-written-apparently." :laugh:
 

RathDarkblade

Moderator
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Mar 24, 2015
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#19
Hmmm. :laugh: You know, somehow this doesn't surprise me in the least. I was a little surprised (and, perhaps, a tiny bit offended) that this person belittled and ignored the advice I tried to give. But oh well! *shrug* :)

As an addendum, I've been writing prose (short stories and novellas of all genres) as well as poetry (haiku, sonnets, and limericks) since I was in high school. I never asked for advice; I simply forged ahead and tried different things, and in the process, found my own "voice" and a method that works for me. In the process, I also read a huge amount of different books - firstly as research, and then for my own enjoyment. :)

But this reminds me of an anecdote I once read about Mozart. ;) A music student approached Mozart and said, "Herr Mozart, I wish to write a symphony. Can you give me some advice on how to get started?"

Replied the maestro, "My good friend, I can only suggest that you start with something simpler. Try writing a fugue, a hymn, or something along these lines. With experience, you'll eventually learn how to write your own symphonies."

The man was astonished. "But Herr Mozart," he protested, "you wrote your first symphony when you were only four years old."

"That's true," replied Mozart. "But I did it without asking for advice."
 
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lwhitehead

Guest
#20
Sorry I put in the wrong place with this posting, and too RathDarkblade sorry for not seeming to take your advise.


I don't belittle or ignore and I'm reading huge amounts of books now what I need to is good PC Writing program,

LW
 

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