Religions say that suicide and Euthanasia is way to the hell

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Evergreen

New Member
Aug 16, 2011
7
1,650
Europe
#1
Islam and Christiany say that suiciders and ppl who died by euthanasia is going to hell - even if they was good and didnt make anything bad.

i think euthanasia is best way to die,but i guess some of Terry Pratchett fans - believe in God and some of them are christians.

I wonder what they think about that euthanasia,suicide and Terry Pratchett chose about euthanasia.

Also i wanna ask - anyone know what does Sir Terry Pratchett think about that "suciders go to hell" thing in religion? And what is Terry Pratchett religion? I cant find this in google on my native language.

I know some ppl quote Terry Pratchett words about atheists "atheist is guy who hates God because God doesnt exist" - I dont know really Terry Pratchett said this words or not?

(Sorry for my bad english)
 

Tonyblack

Super Moderator
City Watch
Jul 25, 2008
30,997
3,650
Cardiff, Wales
#2
Terry Pratchett describes himself as a Humanist. It's clear from his books that he doesn't believe in organised religion and he almost certainly doesn't believe in a God Creator figure.

I'm pretty sure he doesn't believe in Hell either, so he doesn't have to worry about going there.
 

Quatermass

Sergeant-at-Arms
Dec 7, 2010
7,868
2,950
#8
Dotsie said:
You can tell by the good intentions paving slabs.
:laugh:

Well, might as well put my tuppence worth in. I personally think suicide is one of the worst possible decision someone can make. As I have doubts about the existence of any kind of afterlife, I personally feel that it is better to experience for as long as possible than to cease to be.

I can understand actual euthanasia, I would just prefer it to be an absolute last resort, for those for whom there is no hope of a quality of life. In fact, with some people, degenerative illness has pretty much killed the person they once were, and euthanasia is merely the coup de grace.
 

Tonyblack

Super Moderator
City Watch
Jul 25, 2008
30,997
3,650
Cardiff, Wales
#10
It goes like this: organised religions promise that if you live a good life, believe what they tell you and do what you are told, you'll be rewarded after you die. As this is impossible to prove, they can promise whatever they like.

So then believers say to themselves - if life after death is so good, then why wait? I'll just end my life and get on with enjoying the afterlife.

Organised religions say - Damn! We hadn't thought of that. We don't want to encourage that sort of thinking or we'll lose all our supporters. If we don't have any supporters then we're buggered.

So they come up with the idea that taking your own life is a sin and if you do it then you will be thrown into the pits of fire for all eternity.

Phew! That was a close one!!!! :p
 

Quatermass

Sergeant-at-Arms
Dec 7, 2010
7,868
2,950
#11
Tonyblack said:
It goes like this: organised religions promise that if you live a good life, believe what they tell you and do what you are told, you'll be rewarded after you die. As this is impossible to prove, they can promise whatever they like.

So then believers say to themselves - if life after death is so good, then why wait? I'll just end my life and get on with enjoying the afterlife.

Organised religions say - Damn! We hadn't thought of that. We don't want to encourage that sort of thinking or we'll lose all our supporters. If we don't have any supporters then we're buggered.

So they come up with the idea that taking your own life is a sin and if you do it then you will be thrown into the pits of fire for all eternity.

Phew! That was a close one!!!! :p
Nice bit of theological deduction there. :)
 

Jan Van Quirm

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Nov 7, 2008
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#12
:laugh:

There's a distinction between suicide and euthanasia though it can be pretty thin at times. The 'devil' is in the detail as always - euthanasia is something that has to be planned and in most cultures notified and, as people are saying something that is done when there are few or no alternatives. It's a reasoned decision in other words and will normally take some account of the wishes, if not the actually the consent of those closest to the person wanting to die.

Suicide, whilst it may be planned is not generally something that people discuss or if they do, is something that is usually not reasoned and will be resisted by most people to the extent that they will try to prevent their friend or family member from trying to do the deed because it's clearly 'wrong' for whatever reason. Generally suicide is totally irrational and/or unjustifiedon the part of the person wanting to take their own life, because they are incapable of seeing any other route for their life to take, despite being ostensibly 'healthy' for a given value of healthy.

Because of the stigma and very often the secrecy in which suicides are carried out it is shocking and hurtful for those the person leaves behind as it can be seen as a form of rejection and abandonment as well as desperation. This is the true reasoning behind the stand that religious bodies put up against suicide because it does literally devastate families and the larger social circle, not least because it often involves some extreme form of violence to ensure success.
 
Feb 21, 2011
52
2,150
#13
My main problem with euthanasia is the more socially accepted it is the closer we're getting to having blinking lifeclocks embedded in our palms. ;)

I also don't like that by nature it involves other people. Having someone else (particularly a loved one) kill you justs seems like way too much pressure to put on anyone. The alternative is having a paid professional do it which doesn't sit easy with me either.
 

raisindot

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Oct 1, 2009
5,317
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Boston, MA USA
#14
Jan Van Quirm said:
:laugh:

Because of the stigma and very often the secrecy in which suicides are carried out it is shocking and hurtful for those the person leaves behind as it can be seen as a form of rejection and abandonment as well as desperation. This is the true reasoning behind the stand that religious bodies put up against suicide because it does literally devastate families and the larger social circle, not least because it often involves some extreme form of violence to ensure success.
I don't buy that. Most organized religions historically have not given a hoot about the welfare of the families and larger social circles of those who have died. What they do get all gnarly about is the idea that life is a gift from the Deity, and to take one's own life is the equivalent of returning the gift. The clergy who run the show believe that the Deity puts a black mark on their spiritual record for every member of the flock who decides to end life on their own terms.

In the view of organized religions, only the Deity is allowed to determine when one's life can end, even if the end involves torture, disease, incapacitation, starvation, or any other horrible condition for which death would normally be a release. And the Deity is fine with what is essentially suicide if it's done for the right reasons--for example, strapping a bomb on yourself and blowing it up in a marketplace if it's done in the name of that Deity.
 

Dotsie

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Jul 28, 2008
9,069
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#15
Or charging into battle to chop up heathens. Organised religions have very strange ideas about what is and isn't a sin. What you eat and when at one end of the spectrum, who you can kill at the other. And sex somewhere in the middle.
 

Jan Van Quirm

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Nov 7, 2008
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#17
OK - I was going to go cite suicide bombing as an exception to that statement that JIB as usual has homed in on as the thing to quote out of context. :rolleyes:

I chose not to mention that because this is about suicide/euthanasia and not terrorism, patriotism, jihadism/crusading or any other politicised abstraction involving violence and/or oppression and war-like activities because this is about the purely 'normal' human consequences of taking your own life for whatever reason. Religious zealotry/oppression comes under politics ultimately, dress it up however you like :x What Evergreen is talking about is the normal social stigma of suicide and/or assisted death outside of those parameters and it's effects on normal people regardless of faith issues to some extent although most religions proscribe it ordinarily for the reasons you've rightly set out - I agree with those.

What I was and am talking about is the devastation that someone leaves behind them when they take themselves out of the circle of family affection and support with very little or no reason and very often without any warning whatsoever to indicate that they're in distress or ill and commit suicide. Whatever the reason for them going off and jumping off a tall building, or overdosing thoroughly and beyond rescue, or driving themselves off Beachy Head, suicides leave everyone they know utterly shocked and appalled at their actions, followed very swiftly by guilt and trauma at not realising why they'd felt compelled to do such an awful thing that leaves their nearest and dearest without a parent/child/sibling etc and unable to even know how they might have helped to lessen or take away the need for such a terrible solution. I don't care if somebody thinks they have nobody to care what they do - there's always somebody who's there to feel grief and shock over a 'needless' death, even if it's 'only' the poor driver of the bus you chose to walk to oblivion under and the people who were late for work or other myriad and mundane human consequences that will be a result of the traffic chaos caused by that? :devil:

Suicide is a ripple effect, no matter what you do and euthanasia/assisted death is one way to minimise the cause and effect by doing so in a rationalised and inclusive manner so the people you leave behind are in no doubt as to the reason and inevitability of your needing to die and so they are at least spared one shock in knowing it was your genuine choice and they could have done nothing to prevent it. I'll go one further and say that assisted death (not euthanasia as that implies a constraint of choice), actually empowers those left behind to mourn you more comfortably because they may well know that their counsel and/or support will have been of use to you in making the decision even if they did not agree with what you were doing simply because they had an opportunity to voice their opinion before you took that final step of your choice.

The human reaction to premature death is universal and whether or not you are a person of faith (and I am most certainly not such a person) if someone you loved died a sudden, unnecessary and, above all, unanticipated self-administered death you would have wished you could have a) stopped them doing it and b) at least have had a chance to help them in some way before they were too far gone is despair or whatever - that is the reasoning most religions focus on in condemning suicide, not the other extremisms and that is all I meant by the comment. :(
 

poohcarrot

Sergeant-at-Arms
Sep 13, 2009
8,317
2,300
NOT The land of the risen Son!!
#19
Jan Van Quirm said:
Religious zealotry/oppression comes under politics ultimately, dress it up however you like :x
What's the difference between religious zealotry/oppression and voting against the debt ceiling because it doesn't matter anyhoos because the Rapture-is-a-coming.

Doesn't all religion come under politics? o_O
 

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